Perfect Prose Is Dead

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Jocelyn_Uasal

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Okay that's dramatic, but for real what is the point of giving everything I have at trying to craft excellent prose, when it is books like November 9 and milk and honey that get picked up and sell millions?

What I want to write is unrelenting introspectives, but obviously what sells is steamy, problematic romances. (I'm not saying I'm a great writer capable of that, but it's what I'll keep trying to write regardless)

I never would, but I'm very aware that it would be much more marketable to just turn off my brain and write a 200 page werewolf f*ck-fiction book and cash in, and the thought weighs heavy on me.

anyways ima move on and keep writing my messy historical, need anything from the store while I'm gone?
 

Hans.Trondheim

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Perfect prose, huh? Well, language is dynamic, and alive, as my college educ prof says. It changes over time, so what may be popular now, may not be later. Still, write what you want to write about.

Or you can do how I do things.

Just write and publish, whatever the heck comes out of it. lol
 

Jocelyn_Uasal

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Perfect prose, huh? Well, language is dynamic, and alive, as my college educ prof says. It changes over time, so what may be popular now, may not be later. Still, write what you want to write about.

Or you can do how I do things.

Just write and publish, whatever the heck comes out of it. lol
'Perfect prose' is a bit over the top, but I liked the alliteration
 

Kalliel

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I don't even know exactly what prose is. Never searched it up.
 

Gray_Mann

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Personally, I'm reading less and less online-only work as time passes. Everyone wants fast-paced, instant gratification, brain-numbing hogwash. But gods forbid someone take a page or two to describe the scenery, perhaps half a page for someone's general appearance.

That "leave it to the imagination" crap is just a laziness tactic because the writer either can't do it, won't do it because they want to get to the next round of punching and/or fucking, or their readers have the attention span of a goldfish.

Either of these three potentialities absolutely disgusts me. The readers who cry about "descriptive bloat" are the exact same ones who will say they "only have a few minutes a day" to read something so they choose fast-paced non-descriptive crud. Coincidentally, they always end up mentioning that they are gamers which is a time-consuming hobby, or that they like Tolkien/Robert Jordan/G R.R. Martin and so on, writers who are heavily descriptive.

I wish they'd be honest and just say "I don't have the time to read YOUR descriptions." I prefer blunt honesty. Hand-holding sugarcoated responses anger me more than any insult ever would.

As a side note on the "Leave it to the imagination" gripe of mine, I love Cowboy Bebop but I could grab Shinichiro Watanabe by the throat and squeeze every time I hear his response to whether Spike survived in the end. He claimed he left it vague to "Leave it to the viewers imagination."

That is NOT my job. That is your job. Finish the damn story. If you can't, quit using that lame ass cop-out excuse.

All my brain does when I hear that crap, is translate it to "We didn't know which outcome was best for storyline purposes and so we just didn't choose either option and purposely left it blank. HA! Suckers!!"
 

Kureous

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anyways ima move on and keep writing my messy historical, need anything from the store while I'm gone?
Or, you could learn how to sell what you write, perhaps? They're bestsellers for a reason...
 

RepresentingWrath

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Personally, I'm reading less and less online-only work as time passes. Everyone wants fast-paced, instant gratification, brain-numbing hogwash. But gods forbid someone take a page or two to describe the scenery, perhaps half a page for someone's general appearance.

That "leave it to the imagination" crap is just a laziness tactic because the writer either can't do it, won't do it because they want to get to the next round of punching and/or fucking, or their readers have the attention span of a goldfish.
I agree with you partially, but partially disagree. Harry Harrison didn't spend half a page to desribe the scenery or appearance. I doubt he was lazy, and I don't think he is worse than those who wrote long descriptions.
 

Gray_Mann

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I agree with you partially, but partially disagree. Harry Harrison didn't spend half a page to desribe the scenery or appearance. I doubt he was lazy, and I don't think he is worse than those who wrote long descriptions.
Had to make sure you weren't pulling my leg. Harry Harrison sounded like a gag-name. Sadly, I don't know him, so I can't corroborate or argue the point. I'll have to concede and take your word for it.
 

RepresentingWrath

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Had to make sure you weren't pulling my leg. Harry Harrison sounded like a gag-name. Sadly, I don't know him, so I can't corroborate or argue the point. I'll have to concede and take your word for it.
I actually don't remember well enough. The last time I read his works were a couple years ago. I felt like his works were fast paced, and didn't have long descriptions.

I can add something to my point. Over-explainig is just as bad as not explaining at all. I think you should try to balance it, adjusting it according to your own preferences or medium. In the end, web novels are what they are, and they were initially made for reading on your phone. You, personally, might be okay with reading long and descriptive works on your phone. Other people are not, and prefer lighter works, with chapters they can read in 5-10 minutes. You can say lighter = garbage, and I won't argue with you on this, since it is beside the point.
 

Jemini

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Okay that's dramatic, but for real what is the point of giving everything I have at trying to craft excellent prose, when it is books like November 9 and milk and honey that get picked up and sell millions?

What I want to write is unrelenting introspectives, but obviously what sells is steamy, problematic romances. (I'm not saying I'm a great writer capable of that, but it's what I'll keep trying to write regardless)

I never would, but I'm very aware that it would be much more marketable to just turn off my brain and write a 200 page werewolf f*ck-fiction book and cash in, and the thought weighs heavy on me.

anyways ima move on and keep writing my messy historical, need anything from the store while I'm gone?
This sounds like a skill issue to me... or maybe a selection bias. If you look around at the series that are lauded and which actually make it big, well... yeah, they are a little less deep than stuff that was written in the 80s, but they are still incredibly good books on a technical level.

The most recently written of such incredible quality books would be Ascendance of a Bookworm in 2019. Before that, we had the golden age of Isekai in 2011-2012 when we had the "big 5" released in Japan. (Overlord, Shield Hero, Re:Zero, Kono-Suba, and Mushoku Tensei). At around the same time, we had Mother of Learning and WORM releasing for Western audiences.

This is strictly looking at webnovel and litenovel spaces. I believe The Hunger Games also came out somewhere around this period as well, and there are a good few others.

So, yeah. I just think this is a bad take here all around. It is still works that are written at a very high technical level that achieve the most success, it is just that achieving that level requires a LOT of skill. Like, you have to be the writing equivalent of a professional in a sports league. Like, the 1% of the 1% of the 1% of the 1% good, and you also need luck on top of that. But, if the freaking stars align, it is still technical writing skill that wins over steamy romance every single time.

EDIT: Steamy romance is just a cheap tool by which a sub-par writer can see some mild success if they don't want to put in the insane effort to write one of these gems and then cross their fingers the dice turn up in their favor.

EDIT 2: And, if you will look at the time-line, we see an influx of super high-quality gems in the writing world about once every 5 years, and they come in clusters. Right now, we are 5 years out from Ascendance of a Bookworm. We are due in for the next big one. In fact, it's probably already been released somewhere. It's just a matter of an audience finding it now.
 
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Tsuru

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Okay that's dramatic, but for real what is the point of giving everything I have at trying to craft excellent prose, when it is books like November 9 and milk and honey that get picked up and sell millions?

What I want to write is unrelenting introspectives, but obviously what sells is steamy, problematic romances. (I'm not saying I'm a great writer capable of that, but it's what I'll keep trying to write regardless)

I never would, but I'm very aware that it would be much more marketable to just turn off my brain and write a 200 page werewolf f*ck-fiction book and cash in, and the thought weighs heavy on me.

anyways ima move on and keep writing my messy historical, need anything from the store while I'm gone?
Depressing fact :

Some good artists, compared to doing good art (they can / their skills as good), they choose to do FURRY art commissions on twitter.
Reason = $$$

Not blaming them though. $$$ is needed to survive. And too tempting.
 

Jocelyn_Uasal

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Can you bring my dad back from the store? It's been a while.
Weirdly enough? Still in the milk isle.

I guess there's lots of choices ?
Overlord, Shield Hero, Re:Zero, Kono-Suba, and Mushoku Tensei
Also? I'm not saying there aren't any good stories being told, or any media being released, just that there's been a general acceptance in the decrease of quality in books specifically.

As for technical writing, no offense but the LN for mushoku tensei is some of the worst stuff I've ever read in my life. P*do fantasy garbage. As for other recent novels that have literary claim, The Nickel Boys came out in 2019, we've also got Life of Pi and The Kite Runner (Plus Brandon Sanderson) so it's not like there's nothing. But at the same time there's a "tiktokification" happening in publishing where only a few types of books are uplifted, and quantity over quality takes over.
 
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