How do you sort of fictional cultural quirks?

LWFlouisa

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For example, aside from the language, Hafestran is quickly evolving into its own culture separate from French or Japanese.

Ex. The music is like a mixture of Flamenco, Pimba, Southern Tap, and J-Pop. Generally played with The Bones and Shamisen. And I'm only approximating at the moment. Still working on a musical rhythm for it, as it's pretty distinct.
 
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For example, aside from the language, Hafestran is quickly evolving into its own culture separate from French or Japanese.

Ex. The music is like a mixture of Flamenco, Pimba, Southern Tap, and J-Pop. Generally played with The Bones and Shamisen. And I'm only approximating at the moment. Still working on a musical rhythm for it, as it's pretty distinct.
Can you elaborate on what you mean by "sort" ?
 

LWFlouisa

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Can you elaborate on what you mean by "sort" ?

Ah sorry, I mean keep up with as changes happening. I know I was expecting it to be a lot more French, but it's becoming something of its own thing. And I don't mean specific differences: the guillotine evolving from the Berger model of 1871 to more of a firearm like short range women that's highly automated.

( The US in my works is a fractured Union of smaller decentralized nations, even before colonized by foreign powers midway into the 21st century. )

As I write more books, what's becoming apparent is there is this vague hyper linguistic prestige language period, that makes what happened with Latin looks like a relaxing afternoon.
 

Jemini

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Well there's your problem right there, you based your fictional culture on a real world culture. I would say you should allow this cultural divergence and take notes on where it winds up. Then, once it has developed into its own existence, re-write the entire series with the new unique version of the culture in place from the beginning.

(FYI: I say "re-write the entire series" a lot. Well, web-novels are supposed to be a rough draft anyway, so it's more or less expected that if you are actually trying to go somewhere with your work you should be expecting to re-write the entire series at some point.)

I have several very unique cultures in my world, and part of this comes from studying the concept of honor cultures and ethics cultures, deciding which one a particular group is, and then adding what other influences may have affected their culture. FYI: An honor culture is a "might makes right" culture in which disputes are settled with fights, which are fights to the death more often than not. And, the concept of honor is very strong in such a culture, and "besmirching someone's honor" is often an excuse for one of these instances of combat. Honor cultures are more common among warrior cultures. An ethics culture is a culture in which disputes are settled by deliberation by a judge, and is very legalistic. Ethics cultures often have a large number of laws and are concerned with record keeping to the highest degree their current technology will allow for. Ethics cultures are usually more technologically advanced than honor cultures, but there are exceptions both in the direction of technologically primitive ethics cultures, such as certain tribal societies, and technologically advanced honor cultures such as Japan up to the end of WW2. (The old west in the US is also an example of an honor culture.)

As an example, the elves in my world have an ethics culture and their long lives and low birth rate have lead them to develop an intense aversion to war and death. They take all reasonable precautions to keep themselves safe, and value children quite highly. Meanwhile, their affinity with nature magic and the connections they have formed with the tree spirits have lead them to living inside of trees which are actually the physical bodies of those tree spirits which they have a symbiotic relationship with. The elves also do not have the cultural behavior of knocking when they enter a room because letting people into the tree is the role of the tree spirit, not something the one living in the tree has any right to object to.

Little things like whether or not you knock is an important part of culture to consider. Even points of ettiquite like whether or not you say "goodbye" when you end a phone call Vs. just hanging up is a culturally learned behavior, you might see this if you give an old person a phone. Some elderly individuals have not learned proper phone etiquette because the phones were not common when they were young. They might just hang up the phone without saying goodbye in order to signal the call is over.
 

Assurbanipal_II

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Interesting world-building so far. :blob_reach: Keep it up! But what about the plot?
 

Mejiro

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A lot varies by what you need - it's fun, but it's very easy to end up with way more background fluff than you need, and that isn't useful unless you crowbar it in. A lot would also be entirely internalised by the characters so can be hard to find excuses to explain. My main "thing" I'm working on where it actually needs all this sort of cultural detail has about 20, 30 pages of notes, but it's mostly plot related with some extras that have occurred to me over time.
 

LWFlouisa

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Well there's your problem right there, you based your fictional culture on a real world culture. I would say you should allow this cultural divergence and take notes on where it winds up. Then, once it has developed into its own existence, re-write the entire series with the new unique version of the culture in place from the beginning.

(FYI: I say "re-write the entire series" a lot. Well, web-novels are supposed to be a rough draft anyway, so it's more or less expected that if you are actually trying to go somewhere with your work you should be expecting to re-write the entire series at some point.)

I have several very unique cultures in my world, and part of this comes from studying the concept of honor cultures and ethics cultures, deciding which one a particular group is, and then adding what other influences may have affected their culture. FYI: An honor culture is a "might makes right" culture in which disputes are settled with fights, which are fights to the death more often than not. And, the concept of honor is very strong in such a culture, and "besmirching someone's honor" is often an excuse for one of these instances of combat. Honor cultures are more common among warrior cultures. An ethics culture is a culture in which disputes are settled by deliberation by a judge, and is very legalistic. Ethics cultures often have a large number of laws and are concerned with record keeping to the highest degree their current technology will allow for. Ethics cultures are usually more technologically advanced than honor cultures, but there are exceptions both in the direction of technologically primitive ethics cultures, such as certain tribal societies, and technologically advanced honor cultures such as Japan up to the end of WW2. (The old west in the US is also an example of an honor culture.)

As an example, the elves in my world have an ethics culture and their long lives and low birth rate have lead them to develop an intense aversion to war and death. They take all reasonable precautions to keep themselves safe, and value children quite highly. Meanwhile, their affinity with nature magic and the connections they have formed with the tree spirits have lead them to living inside of trees which are actually the physical bodies of those tree spirits which they have a symbiotic relationship with. The elves also do not have the cultural behavior of knocking when they enter a room because letting people into the tree is the role of the tree spirit, not something the one living in the tree has any right to object to.

Little things like whether or not you knock is an important part of culture to consider. Even points of ettiquite like whether or not you say "goodbye" when you end a phone call Vs. just hanging up is a culturally learned behavior, you might see this if you give an old person a phone. Some elderly individuals have not learned proper phone etiquette because the phones were not common when they were young. They might just hang up the phone without saying goodbye in order to signal the call is over.

Ah interesting! So it is common to actually completely rewrite a series then?

I had actually considered that, but as it's meant to be science fiction and not fantasy where a completely fictional culture is more common, that might end up being difficult.

But for this next story, who knows honestly.

Actually the biggest reason I've considered rewriting the series: there is a lot of things I do now as a writer, that would have been completely foreign to myself as a writer ten years ago: namely meta fictional elements, and the tendency for characters to be aware of the fact they're in a Light Novel by a sadistic creator. ( In their opinion, not mine. )
 

CupcakeNinja

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Ah interesting! So it is common to actually completely rewrite a series then?

I had actually considered that, but as it's meant to be science fiction and not fantasy where a completely fictional culture is more common, that might end up being difficult.

But for this next story, who knows honestly.

Actually the biggest reason I've considered rewriting the series: there is a lot of things I do now as a writer, that would have been completely foreign to myself as a writer ten years ago: namely meta fictional elements, and the tendency for characters to be aware of the fact they're in a Light Novel by a sadistic creator. ( In their opinion, not mine. )
Like you CAN rewrite it. But personally? I would just do a soft reboot. By which i mean if you publish here for example, i would take a break from new chapters and edit old chapters. Replace their content with the new info i want in the story. Then just make an announcement detailing the changes and linking to the newly edited chapters

You can even copy all the chapters and reupload the story and label it a rewrite or reboot if you wanna go a step further.

Cuz fuck i wouldnt wanna rewrite everything and i dont see a need to go that far anyways especially since this isnt an officially published work. Dont make things harder for yourself than they need to be, mate. Rewrite everything from the ground up just aint needed most times. And you might forget stuff or write it different/worse than how it was before and get stressed out and all that shit. Why out yourself through that torture?

Through the power of editing all things are possible.
 

LWFlouisa

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Like you CAN rewrite it. But personally? I would just do a soft reboot. By which i mean if you publish here for example, i would take a break from new chapters and edit old chapters. Replace their content with the new info i want in the story. Then just make an announcement detailing the changes and linking to the newly edited chapters

You can even copy all the chapters and reupload the story and label it a rewrite or reboot if you wanna go a step further.

Cuz fuck i wouldnt wanna rewrite everything and i dont see a need to go that far anyways especially since this isnt an officially published work. Dont make things harder for yourself than they need to be, mate. Rewrite everything from the ground up just aint needed most times. And you might forget stuff or write it different/worse than how it was before and get stressed out and all that shit. Why out yourself through that torture?

Through the power of editing all things are possible.

I like that approach!

Currently working on 21st Century Charlotte, which is about, literally, the reincarnation of Charlotte Corday who is currently haunting the robotic body of a Battle Angel. ( You can probably see where my influences are. )

But after that, I'm sense I return to Magical Realism over science fiction. ( There are some similarities, Magical Realism for Fantasy would be like Mundane Science Fiction for scifi, while Urban Fantasy is closer to Cyberpunk. )
 

CupcakeNinja

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I like that approach!

Currently working on 21st Century Charlotte, which is about, literally, the reincarnation of Charlotte Corday who is currently haunting the robotic body of a Battle Angel. ( You can probably see where my influences are. )

But after that, I'm sense I return to Magical Realism over science fiction. ( There are some similarities, Magical Realism for Fantasy would be like Mundane Science Fiction for scifi, while Urban Fantasy is closer to Cyberpunk. )
Is it gonna be a hard magic system type of thing, you think? Gotta be careful with magical realism. Either things gotta be properly vague and mystical but not deus ex levels of asspull, or you need strict rules for what the magic aspect can do.

You seem the type of dude who would put thought into that kinda thing instead of playing it loose and fast, am i right?
 

LWFlouisa

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Is it gonna be a hard magic system type of thing, you think? Gotta be careful with magical realism. Either things gotta be properly vague and mystical but not deus ex levels of asspull, or you need strict rules for what the magic aspect can do.

You seem the type of dude who would put thought into that kinda thing instead of playing it loose and fast, am i right?

Sort of, I didn't really have a magic system, so much as have technology that was so advanced that it felt comparably magical compared to the technology that was more generally available.

It's why Magical Realism is such a weird direction, if going with the Gabriel Garcia Marquez tradition.

Although fun bit of trivia, I tested a thing to see if a Machine Learning algorithm could actually print itself onto a piece of paper. So maybe a sentient game character that 3D prints itself a physical avatar as an end-game reward isn't that far off.

One of the main used to be a game character, that printed themselves into 3D space.

Right Now A.D. / Next Sunday kind of stuff. Or it's evolved in such way that it couldn't possibly happen anymore, because it was contingent on certain historical things having come to pass.

So Life Without A GUI is quite the change.
 
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Jemini

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Like you CAN rewrite it. But personally? I would just do a soft reboot. By which i mean if you publish here for example, i would take a break from new chapters and edit old chapters. Replace their content with the new info i want in the story. Then just make an announcement detailing the changes and linking to the newly edited chapters

You can even copy all the chapters and reupload the story and label it a rewrite or reboot if you wanna go a step further.

Cuz fuck i wouldnt wanna rewrite everything and i dont see a need to go that far anyways especially since this isnt an officially published work. Dont make things harder for yourself than they need to be, mate. Rewrite everything from the ground up just aint needed most times. And you might forget stuff or write it different/worse than how it was before and get stressed out and all that shit. Why out yourself through that torture?

Through the power of editing all things are possible.

Yeah, by "re-write," what I typically mean when I say that is major overhaul level editing of the entire series, not scrapping the entire thing and re-writing from scratch. When I do it, what I typically do is copy my original version of the chapter and save it under a new name (normally just adding the words "draft 2" to the end of it.) Then, I read it through line by line, and re-write a similar paragraph that conveys the exact same meaning, but is just better written. I go through the entire series doing this, and will also make some minor changes along the way if I need to update older parts to conform to newer ideas I've had.

I have yet to do this with my series I'm posting here, but I did start it on my first chapter a while back. Kinda stopped in the process half way through, mostly because I got stressed having to keep putting out new chapters at the same time. (Yes, I did not stop my series when I went about doing this.)
 
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