Fantasy Action Opinion: Most Important Role/Class In Teamplay

[TASTYLEADPAINT]

Hello everyone, I am an author, and I really; REALLY enjoyed fantasy actions, medieval hand-to-hand and simply magics and stuff.
I've gotten into some DnD session, and was trying to write some novels for myself, that is when I arosed a question

In a dungeon raiding scenario, with a full team up to 10 or more, which role would be THE MOST important?

To get the dinosaurs out (Tyler they're at your doors again). Yes, every class is important, bla bla, shamans, enchantress enables the frontline, the Paladin create spaces and time, the damage dealers would be the one to hold the tempo of the fight... One class enables the other, they would be exposed without blablap your mom's home Brad.

But in a sense; if you're writing a story, and you want a character to hold the most important class or role of the team, maybe because you love being a harry stu, maybe you want them to feel the pressure, either way; which class or role would you think of?

Let's say for example, a full team BUT without a knight in shining armor in the front holding their shields or swords.
The team could be long ranged and fast or distancing.
Damage dealers? There's consumable/throwables for that, or just play safe until the enemies tire themselves out if they can't one shot us, the tanks might be in a bit of pain though.
Full team but no healers/support/buffs?
Fuck it, one shot everything, go home, rest, health potions.

Maybe some background stuff? Blacksmith? Nah afaik, go to a random town and there's a bearded dude doing it for money, no need to be a part of a team, and only needed for like... Once a month to repolish/resharpening?
Luggage carrier? Well maybe, but there exists pocket dimensions in some cases

Please leave your opinion!

it would be the dedicated healer. weather or not you die is on them

 

[RepresentingCaution]

Since you're asking about the most important role in TEAMplay, it's the healer. The healer gets the least glory but contributes the most to other teammates. Also, most of you wouldn't be alive without IRL healers. If your mom, grandmother, great-grandmother, etc. needed medical intervention to live before/during their reproductive years, you wouldn't exist without healers.

 

[LesserSarcasm]

Do away with the (expanded) holy trinity and have classes that incorperate functions of all 3 or 5 or however many classes are required for a no brainer press buttons to win party. If your looking for a definite case its the damage mitigation class aspects of healer classes specilly if they are percent hp based

 

[Cipiteca396]

The Adventurer class. You get skills and abilities as needed, and use them to an above average skill level.

---

... If you desperately want an answer though, it's 100% the rogue. Your healer is useless if your tank gets crushed under a 12 ton boulder trap he didn't notice. Your backline will die if nobody is around to notice the assassin monster sneaking up on them.

All the support, tank or dps in the world is useless if you're too dead to use it.

And that is heavily amplified the larger the party is. You're bringing TEN people into a dungeon? What happens when you get separated? When traps appear?

You might be able to bull through combat with shear weight of numbers, but that'll just lead to needless injury if you don't properly deal with traps or ambushes.

And what are you going to do if you get to the end of the dungeon without ever finding the secret treasure rooms? What a waste of time and life.

In order of priority for dungeon delving, you want:
Scouting and Knowledge, Retreat, Damage Mitigation, Control, Damage Recovery, Supply and Resupply, Damage Dealing.

Once you're aware of a threat, you can choose to tackle it head on or retreat to safety. If you're not aware of the threat, you're dead.

 

[georgelee5786]

Tank.

 

[Iamnotabot]

Tank.

Tank priest or a paladin.

 

[georgelee5786]

Tank priest or a paladin.

A paladin turned priest who happens to have a lot of giant armor

 

[Jemini]

I think the correct way to approach this is in terms of which role allows you to up your overall party effectiveness the most. Just like every role is important, it's also possible to adjust your tactics around the absence of just about any role you could happen to name. So, which role, when absent, requires such an adjustment of tactics that it actually harms your ability to take on tough enemies the most?

If this is your question, there are 2 roles that up your party's level average in terms of the level of enemies you can deal with. Those two roles are tank and healer. And, healer is the more impactful of the two by this standard. You can adjust tactics around not having a tank so long as you've got a healer and let your damage dealers recklessly smash at the enemies for a while.

That said, you can't knock mono-parties in terms of specialized tactics. An all rogues party can just do things other parties can't since they all specialize in stealth. In fact, I think just about any mono-party in which all members have the same role is better than a diversified party with a role missing. In other words, it is literally the case that all roles missing except one is better than only one role missing.

(Also, did you seriously say a 10 man D&D party? As someone who's done some DMing myself, I would consider 6 people a rather large party. 10 sounds outright unmanagable.)

 

[melchi]

If the game is like a MMO I'd go with tank 100%. Just by having to be the first person leading the charge they assume a leadership position by default. Even someone tanking that really doesn't have a strat will be watched by the healers and DPS to set the flow of the fight.

Tank attacks something? DPS attack the same thing. Tank takes damage? Healer casts healing spells on the tank.

Depending on the system this breaks down though. Like in D&D clerics are just so OP so a full party of clerics could be more viable. In that case would would be the leader? The most senior cleric?

Conversely, if the dungeon is full of traps would the person who can detect/disarm traps be more fit for the leadership roll?

Another example could be like in Diablo 3, where a Zdps is the most important. Someone that can increase vuln of enemies, reduce damage of allies, and crowd control is the most important in a group. Yeah, they do next to no damage, but if they can take 1000% of the beating of their allies, and increase the damage 100% while reducing damage taken by 75% of allies then the fact they can't kill anything is not important to the rest of the value brought to the table.

 

[ConansWitchBaby]

The peasant and their cannon bodies.

 

[gaylolis]

If I were to organize a dungeon raid, the most important thing is INFORMATION.

Knowing the right things will be the deciding factor between a total wipeout and successful expedition. Anyone trustworthy with the best reconnaissance and information gathering ability should have the most appreciation, not healers. There are always alternative for healer, like recovery items and even anyone could heal a minor healing spell. Though making a fatal mistake due to lack of information can mean instant death with no compromises.

What are you going to do if the Dungeon actually makes it so your healing will cause damage instead? Hurt your teammates hoping it would heal them? In Fantasy stories, I would assume their enclosed environment will be as weird as your imagination allows, it even defies expectation itself. Standard dungeons would be rather boring tbh.

What's similarly important is having a good LEADER. No matter how stacked your composition is, there's high risk of infighting and backstabbing each other, if the Leader couldn't root out bad seedlings and make it so the team has good chemistry with each other.

Both the Rogue (Reconnaisance) and the Leader ideally should have the best cooperation since they might decide whether the party would live or die.

While two of them were the most essential, the rest of the party should play according the Dungeon's characteristics, while also being versatile enough to cope with any unexpected situations that may occur.

For the classes itself, the more universal their utility is, the better. Dual types like physical / magic over pure magic or physical. And many element masteries instead of just being exceptional at one.

It's also a plus point if each member also could defend themselves on top of that, rather than relying on others to cover for them. There's no telling if one won't make a mistake that will cost someone's life, in case they couldn't defend themselves.

For my favorites, probably among like this:

Paladin / Cleric : All Rounder Support / DPS -> they're probably the Party Leader since iirc the qualities of the best of their class also correspond to a good leader.
Battle Mage: DPS
Rogue / Thief / Assassin: Recon + Other Stuff -> basically carries the team
Summoner who can also fight close quarters -> their summon can also fit many situations
Engineer -> has many tools at their disposal to utilize all fronts and cover their weaknesses
Bard -> Kinda biased, but I feel any good party should at least have a good bard. Sometimes what you need to clinch an almost impossible feat is a moral support. I do hear that Bard is incredibly versatile as well. They can pretty much fit any roles you want them to.

You can slot in more niche classes and roles to fit peculiar dungeons. I feel dedicated Tank also fits this category.

I won't expect most enemies to be so stupid, they ignore the greatest threats and instead went for the meat shield, especially in the hardest dungeons. Though perhaps they can be an essential part if they also mastered Crowd Control. I do feel being able to disable the threats consistently is better than pure tanking, esp if the enemy has some nasty AOE and skills.

 

[Viator]

In my mind, in a group of 10 or more coordination is key. A commander-type class would probably work best. (There were classes such as martial in 3.5) the reality is a dungeonering group that large full of individualists (as players often are) you need a leader to keep them together. Otherwise many group members making individual decisions just get in each other's way and endanger lives. For small groups individualism is okay, but larger groups need some form of cohesion to stave off chaos.

 

[Tsuru]

Hello everyone, I am an author, and I really; REALLY enjoyed fantasy actions, medieval hand-to-hand and simply magics and stuff.
I've gotten into some DnD session, and was trying to write some novels for myself, that is when I arosed a question

In a dungeon raiding scenario, with a full team up to 10 or more, which role would be THE MOST important?

To get the dinosaurs out (Tyler they're at your doors again). Yes, every class is important, bla bla, shamans, enchantress enables the frontline, the Paladin create spaces and time, the damage dealers would be the one to hold the tempo of the fight... One class enables the other, they would be exposed without blablap your mom's home Brad.

But in a sense; if you're writing a story, and you want a character to hold the most important class or role of the team, maybe because you love being a harry stu, maybe you want them to feel the pressure, either way; which class or role would you think of?

Let's say for example, a full team BUT without a knight in shining armor in the front holding their shields or swords.
The team could be long ranged and fast or distancing.
Damage dealers? There's consumable/throwables for that, or just play safe until the enemies tire themselves out if they can't one shot us, the tanks might be in a bit of pain though.
Full team but no healers/support/buffs?
Fuck it, one shot everything, go home, rest, health potions.

Maybe some background stuff? Blacksmith? Nah afaik, go to a random town and there's a bearded dude doing it for money, no need to be a part of a team, and only needed for like... Once a month to repolish/resharpening?
Luggage carrier? Well maybe, but there exists pocket dimensions in some cases

Please leave your opinion!

Serious answer : The leader that makes decision. Or the person that can remove traps/scout ahead

Joke answer : The lucky guy that roll a perfect roll, causing his stone throw attack against a demi-god, to SOMEHOW kill it

 

[TheEldritchGod]

in d20 3.0/3.5 If I take a major bloodline, minor bloodline, trivial bloodline, then pay the 6 level penalty (which I can pay off at first level), I get to add those 6 levels to the class abilities of another class, but not the class level, but not to advance spellcasting. However, If I then take a single level in Eidoloncer, it's class ability is to add to spellcasting. So I take one level of Erudite. I'm only second level, but for same amount of XP as a 4th level character, I have psionics as a 7th level psion. And since it is an erudite, I can then buy any Arcane spells as if I was 5th. Oh, that is ANY arcane, which includes from the trapsmith spell list as well as bard.

Basically, why you dudes are playing whimpy clerics, I have the same amount of healing, access to all arcane and psion powers, and with the build I have in mind, I'll be taking about 4 actions BEFORE you get inititive. Oh, and if I do die, I promise I'll already have forced dream/Time hop primed to go off and reset the day.

Basically, I'll be immortal by 2nd level, yet casting as if I was 7th.

And I haven't even explained how I can make a 100th level familiar, combine it with ectoplasm rules, and WEAR MY FAMILIAR LIKE A SUIT, but that won't be until about 5th level.

Oh for the fun of it I'll pick up a level of monk, but the bloodline shenanigans kick in and I'll be punching like my fists were six-handed scissor swords and my Touch AC will be lower than my base AC. Yes. It will actually be easier to hit me with a weapon than just touch me. I just need a 6,000 gp customized bracers of Armor.



The most powerful Class is POWER GAMER

Here:
My D20 Noob Handbook
It'll give you a much better idea of game balance. Definitely scroll down to 21 traps for noobs. That's the general game theory section.

 

[HiddenDraconic]

I'd have to say the logistics class. This could be the healer or wizard or such, this kinda varies from setting to setting and group to group. This would be the multi-tool jack of all trades that does the majority of the non combat duties.

 

[AiLovesToGrow]

Obviously it depends on the dungeon, the levels of magic, and a host of other factors. When I think of a delving party, I don't think of a "raid" in the same way people would think: go in, collect loot, back before lunch. To me, a dungeon delve is an excursion, something that could take months. Using this metric, it comes down to the same things that a long term military infiltration unit would face. The primary issues? Up to date intel, geographical knowledge, supplies procurement.

Up to date intel: Scrying class. Knowing where targets are or what targets need to be avoided are so important and it typically scares me that people think in terms of games when looking at a dungeon because they think "I'm the best because I play games." You know who would be the best? Actual trained military units that assess threats and treat them accordingly.

Geographical knowledge: Ranger or Bard class, depending. Once the scrying finds something, need to have someone with the knowledge to know what they are looking at. To know the difference between a goblin and a kobold, to speak various languages and barter for passage and supplies, to understand how the ice room isn't safe because it is enchanted with a curse, can't you tell, the ice is green, that is poison curse!

Supplies procurement: either a class with a spatial pocket of some kind, the ability to conjure supplies or a foraging class mixed with crafting. In real combat, ammo is spent, weapons break, healing supplies used. If the delve is to last for any amount of time, need to replenish those supplies. And that doesn't take into the idea of food and water.

All forms of combat classes should be treated in a Rock Paper Scissors fashion, because there is no universal Best Combat class. Depending on the threats involved inside a dungeon, different combat formations would work better than others. So long as the above rolls are filled, can really work with any group that meets basic requirements.

 

[unknownking]

Hello everyone, I am an author, and I really; REALLY enjoyed fantasy actions, medieval hand-to-hand and simply magics and stuff.
I've gotten into some DnD session, and was trying to write some novels for myself, that is when I arosed a question

In a dungeon raiding scenario, with a full team up to 10 or more, which role would be THE MOST important?

To get the dinosaurs out (Tyler they're at your doors again). Yes, every class is important, bla bla, shamans, enchantress enables the frontline, the Paladin create spaces and time, the damage dealers would be the one to hold the tempo of the fight... One class enables the other, they would be exposed without blablap your mom's home Brad.

But in a sense; if you're writing a story, and you want a character to hold the most important class or role of the team, maybe because you love being a harry stu, maybe you want them to feel the pressure, either way; which class or role would you think of?

Let's say for example, a full team BUT without a knight in shining armor in the front holding their shields or swords.
The team could be long ranged and fast or distancing.
Damage dealers? There's consumable/throwables for that, or just play safe until the enemies tire themselves out if they can't one shot us, the tanks might be in a bit of pain though.
Full team but no healers/support/buffs?
Fuck it, one shot everything, go home, rest, health potions.

Maybe some background stuff? Blacksmith? Nah afaik, go to a random town and there's a bearded dude doing it for money, no need to be a part of a team, and only needed for like... Once a month to repolish/resharpening?
Luggage carrier? Well maybe, but there exists pocket dimensions in some cases

Please leave your opinion!

It depends on the enemy type one will face.

For example a team full of mages would probably work fine when you are fighting against swarms of enemies. If everyone is using aoe attacks it is an easy win. A pure rogue team wouldn't far well against swarm.

One has to remember that an allround team is better if you are facing unknown territory. Pure teams only work if you know what you are facing.

 

[BearlyAlive]

Either scouting or healing/buffing. Everything else can be compromised but those two are essential for not being killed