Need Help In my OP Side Character

[MakBow]

So, in the novel, the idea for the OP side character is that:

He is incredibly overpowered, the strongest in the magus world, a literal world-wide threat, seeing that power is everything in the world, leading him to be a death row inmate, but since they can't kill him, my MC, who was his childhood friend had turned him into a Hunter (Think of heroes in Sentenced to be a Hero, although they reduce their sentence by killing, in the character's case, his name being Reinhardt or Spriggan, my MC, Noah, keeps him under check.

Reinhardt believes that Noah understand shim fully and how important he truly is, as such, he had willingly allowed Noah to set parameters on his power, kind of like the Bird of Hermes, willingly cutting his power under limits to serve Noah, seeing Noah as a true friend.

How we feeling about this kind of character?

Of course, I left a few things out until I can say for certain I want them to be there.

Edit
Well, I changed some things on Reinhardt, and I decided for the WHY is simple...
Curiosity

He is not a human, but a powerful artifact that became sentient and possessed the body of a child when Noah was still a kid, aimlessly wandering without purpose, but when he met Noah when they were kids, Noah took interest in him and invited him to the friend group, sparking his first ever emotion, something he should be incapable of...Curiosity, the desire to understand humans & mimic them, finding them entertaining and that caused him to believe that Noah was stronger than he let on.

There's also the fact that he believes that power is everything, that nothing matters unless you have power, that virtue is useless and simply coping of weakness, but he believes Noah understands that truly, and because Noah not only sparked his curiosity and understands him, he trust Noah to his fate, seeing Noah as someone that surpasses even him despite him being the strongest in raw power, someone he could never reach, someone who has what ultimately cuts him short...humanity.

In short, he allows Noah to hold his fate because he sees Noah as the final obstacle, the final challenge to gain ultimate power and to do that, he needs to grasp who Noah is as he believes it and for that to happen, he believe that he must allow Noah to control him, to see how he is used and if Noah is the key to allowing his ascension into ultimate power.

Oh, and his power isn't permanently limited, he can request permission to unlock one of three parameters from Noah and Noah can grant the request if needed (Noah doesn't need to physically be present)
(No, Reinhardt cannot lie as he has a curse mark that forces him to always speak the truth or say nothing at all.)

 

[MFontana]

It really depends, like so many other things, on the execution.
The question, ultimately, is WHY.
What motivation, belief, or rules govern the character.
And why did they even allow it to begin with.
For a character with the psychology you described, they wouldn't reasonably obey or allow such a thing to reduce their power.
Even if it was a friend, because to them, even that friend is less valuable than their power, and their pursuit of more.

The best example of what you're presenting in popular culture would be Alucard; from Hellsing (Specifically Hellsing Ultimate if you're referencing the anime).

He was defeated by Integra's ancestor and captured. As part of it, his powers were bound/sealed, and he was bound to service to the Head of the family.

 

[MakBow]

It really depends, like so many other things, on the execution.
The question, ultimately, is WHY.
What motivation, belief, or rules govern the character.
And why did they even allow it to begin with.
For a character with the psychology you described, they wouldn't reasonably obey or allow such a thing to reduce their power.
Even if it was a friend, because to them, even that friend is less valuable than their power, and their pursuit of more.

The best example of what you're presenting in popular culture would be Alucard; from Hellsing (Specifically Hellsing Ultimate if you're referencing the anime).

He was defeated by Integra's ancestor and captured. As part of it, his powers were bound/sealed, and he was bound to service to the Head of the family.

Well, I changed some things on Reinhardt, and I decided for the WHY is simple...
Curiosity

He is not a human, but a powerful artifact that became sentient and possessed the body of a child when Noah was still a kid, aimlessly wandering without purpose, but when he met Noah when they were kids, Noah took interest in him and invited him to the friend group, sparking his first ever emotion, something he should be incapable of...Curiosity, the desire to understand humans & mimic them, finding them entertaining and that caused him to believe that Noah was stronger than he let on.

There's also the fact that he believes that power is everything, that nothing matters unless you have power, that virtue is useless and simply coping of weakness, but he believes Noah understands that truly, and because Noah not only sparked his curiosity and understands him, he trust Noah to his fate, seeing Noah as someone that surpasses even him despite him being the strongest in raw power, someone he could never reach, someone who has what ultimately cuts him short...humanity.

In short, he allows Noah to hold his fate because he sees Noah as the final obstacle, the final challenge to gain ultimate power and to do that, he needs to grasp who Noah is as he believes it and for that to happen, he believe that he must allow Noah to control him, to see how he is used and if Noah is the key to allowing his ascension into ultimate power.

Oh, and his power isn't permanently limited, he can request permission to unlock one of three parameters from Noah and Noah can grant the request if needed (Noah doesn't need to physically be present)
(No, Reinhardt cannot lie as he has a curse mark that forces him to always speak the truth or say nothing at all.)

 

[TheKillingAlice]

So, in the novel, the idea for the OP side character is that:

He is incredibly overpowered, the strongest in the magus world, a literal world-wide threat, seeing that power is everything in the world, leading him to be a death row inmate, but since they can't kill him, my MC, who was his childhood friend had turned him into a Hunter (Think of heroes in Sentenced to be a Hero, although they reduce their sentence by killing, in the character's case, his name being Reinhardt or Spriggan, my MC, Noah, keeps him under check.

Reinhardt believes that Noah understand shim fully and how important he truly is, as such, he had willingly allowed Noah to set parameters on his power, kind of like the Bird of Hermes, willingly cutting his power under limits to serve Noah, seeing Noah as a true friend.

How we feeling about this kind of character?

Of course, I left a few things out until I can say for certain I want them to be there.

I agree with what @MFontana said, but would also like to add:
In a setting like this, even if it's about "true friendship", you will have to make sure to put in either a higher goal or a very close, deep reaching friendship; maybe the "villain" character had, in pursuit of his power, never let anyone get close to him again, yet retained that one friendship as his single point of social contact. Does he have family? Someone he loves? At the same time, it will definitely cause people to see their relationship as a type of romantic love, I will put that out there right away, so you are warned.
And I'm not just saying this because I read and write preferably gay romance, but because these types of relationships would invite people to say that if they were male and female, but as soon as they are both male and someone says anything the like, everyone gets their panties in a twist (*cough* Naruto *cough*).
Anyway, the reason for that is that a simple friend, no matter how precious, is normally not your first and foremost priority. First is always yourself, because if you are gone, you can't see to anyone's safety - unless your sacrifice will be the thing to ensure that safety. After that are your own children, because they are the next generation and, when it comes to evolution, nothing is more important to living beings than the survival of their own kind. Next is the spouse. After that are family members of the direct lineage, like parents and siblings, but that also depends on your relationship with them; who raised you; who was there in your childhood with you and shares a deeper bond. If the bond isn't deep with your family, friends may come first, if they were more like siblings to you.
But if you are so lonely, that there is no one but your single friend, yet you felt the need to retain that single friend without cutting them off over time, that would mean there has to be something there that sets him apart. It would be one thing to still have nostalgia or sympathy for him and at least not killing him, even as he appears as an enemy - but binding your powers to "serve" him? That's a bit much. You gotta come up with something believable, or you will have people squatting there, asking you when they finally kiss. Just a friendly prophecy from your local gay romance writer and shipper.

Anyway, as I said, I second what the first comment already said, just had to add some spice on top.

 

[Ghundi_FreeMail]

So, in the novel, the idea for the OP side character is that:

He is incredibly overpowered, the strongest in the magus world, a literal world-wide threat, seeing that power is everything in the world, leading him to be a death row inmate, but since they can't kill him, my MC, who was his childhood friend had turned him into a Hunter (Think of heroes in Sentenced to be a Hero, although they reduce their sentence by killing, in the character's case, his name being Reinhardt or Spriggan, my MC, Noah, keeps him under check.

Reinhardt believes that Noah understand shim fully and how important he truly is, as such, he had willingly allowed Noah to set parameters on his power, kind of like the Bird of Hermes, willingly cutting his power under limits to serve Noah, seeing Noah as a true friend.

How we feeling about this kind of character?

Of course, I left a few things out until I can say for certain I want them to be there.

While I'm in no way considered a proper writer, so it's best to take my word with a grain of salt. But other than what MFontanta said (Which is a damn good advice) in the aftermath of asking the HOW question, you must ask Now What for your character. because we as human beings are naturally independent creatures or actively looking for independence. So, there's no such thing as true loyalty even if the MC and the Side characters are both childhood friends, there will come a moment where the side Character "Reinhardt" feels 'weak' or 'unable' to do something that he was always capable of and he tells himself "If only my power wasn't bounded/capped" and that seed gives birth to doubt and unfortunately (if let fester) to resentment, and then it'll depend on how you the writer/author want to develop later on, if you want angst/tension you can live that wound to keep festering, or if you want the theme to be lighter, let them both talk it out (at some point in the future before the breaking point) and the tension won't be plaguing your story anymore, and (if you're brave enough) can make it as some kind of an inside running joke. Anyway, that was my two cents, hope this helps.

 

[MakBow]

While I'm in no way considered a proper writer, so it's best to take my word with a grain of salt. But other than what MFontanta said (Which is a damn good advice) in the aftermath of asking the HOW question, you must ask Now What for your character. because we as human beings are naturally independent creatures or actively looking for independence. So, there's no such thing as true loyalty even if the MC and the Side characters are both childhood friends, there will come a moment where the side Character "Reinhardt" feels 'weak' or 'unable' to do something that he was always capable of and he tells himself "If only my power wasn't bounded/capped" and that seed gives birth to doubt and unfortunately (if let fester) to resentment, and then it'll depend on how you the writer/author want to develop later on, if you want angst/tension you can live that wound to keep festering, or if you want the theme to be lighter, let them both talk it out (at some point in the future before the breaking point) and the tension won't be plaguing your story anymore, and (if you're brave enough) can make it as some kind of an inside running joke. Anyway, that was my two cents, hope this helps.

This is a lot to unpack.

Feeling weak won't happen since I edited that he can freely ask for permission to let his parameters off, one to three, so he isn't permanently capped (definitely should have added that first).

To keep tension, Noah is always skeptical of using Reinhardt as he does not have a great reputation, seen as a monster, unlike Noah, who is widely famous and loved by many, so it's like having a nuclear bomb on the ready and he doesn't want people to fear him.

It would also go against Reinhardt's character to feel resentment because he is incapable of feeling emotions other than curiosity because of his nature as a non-human, as such, he is always acting cheerful and joyful.

 

[Conqueror_Quack]

Sounds like Alucard from hellsing, it's a similar setting to him and integra.

 

[MakBow]

Sounds like Alucard from hellsing, it's a similar setting to him and integra.

Yeah, it's certainly inspired, yes.

 

[Conqueror_Quack]

Yeah, it's certainly inspired, yes.

Mmm just saw Fontana's post, I didn't know that he already mentioned it.

 

[TheKillingAlice]

Well, I changed some things on Reinhardt, and I decided for the WHY is simple...
Curiosity

He is not a human, but a powerful artifact that became sentient and possessed the body of a child when Noah was still a kid, aimlessly wandering without purpose, but when he met Noah when they were kids, Noah took interest in him and invited him to the friend group, sparking his first ever emotion, something he should be incapable of...Curiosity, the desire to understand humans & mimic them, finding them entertaining and that caused him to believe that Noah was stronger than he let on.

There's also the fact that he believes that power is everything, that nothing matters unless you have power, that virtue is useless and simply coping of weakness, but he believes Noah understands that truly, and because Noah not only sparked his curiosity and understands him, he trust Noah to his fate, seeing Noah as someone that surpasses even him despite him being the strongest in raw power, someone he could never reach, someone who has what ultimately cuts him short...humanity.

In short, he allows Noah to hold his fate because he sees Noah as the final obstacle, the final challenge to gain ultimate power and to do that, he needs to grasp who Noah is as he believes it and for that to happen, he believe that he must allow Noah to control him, to see how he is used and if Noah is the key to allowing his ascension into ultimate power.

Oh, and his power isn't permanently limited, he can request permission to unlock one of three parameters from Noah and Noah can grant the request if needed (Noah doesn't need to physically be present)
(No, Reinhardt cannot lie as he has a curse mark that forces him to always speak the truth or say nothing at all.)

So I just walked out of the room and came back to realize that you had actually posted something right before I sent the text that I wrote. Basically everything is now for naught, but aside from that, that extra bit of additional information makes the whole thing seem to be less kohesive of a story than before, somehow.

Like, let's go through this real quick, shall we?
He is a being that isn't human. But he does use a human body, so where did he come from? If he was "wandering", why is no one looking for him? This would have been something huge, even if the parents didn't know - other people would have had some encounter with him, as he was wandering about, likely doing things that got on others nerves. He would have retaliated at some point, in some way; shown his power.
But somehow, that's not the case. So, he finds Noah, who seemingly acts like a doofus, fooling around with a child that isn't even human and wouldn't have known the first thing about pretending to be human (if he does later, he wouldn't have back then). But let's say he did, why is it only Noah who's important to him and no one else from his "friend group"?
I always found these reasonings about how someone is important to a grand being, just because they aren't afraid of them or show interest that appears to be selfless, a very weak foundation to build up a relationship on, that goes far enough to be considered an obsession. It's fine if there's a different reason for the two of them to be together and that first interest only sparks the relationship, but later on is build with entirely different things, just going back to that one selfless personality trait. But here, it just seems void of anything of that sort; it seems like others could have filled that space just fine. It creates this forced importance of a character that leaves people WISHING it would just turn out that he's in love with the other after all, regardless of characters; it's not shipping, it's trying to understand why.
He is also interested in him and his "strength" from the beginning, so why would he become "strong", when the strength Noah has is clearly not physical, as Noah would have been a real child back then? He should have understood very soon that magic or physical strength isn't the thing that gives Noah his perceived "strength".
You say that only Noah "truly understands" him, but those are just words; they don't mean anything. What is it that Noah understands about him? And what is it that Reinhardt thinks he knows and understands about him?
Why is his "humanity" what Reinhardt thinks is the thing that surpasses him? And if that is truly his understanding of the situation, after becoming stronger and stronger, wouldn't he have wanted to stay close to Noah before that? He should have wanted to surround himself with humans; to emulate them.
Who knows? Then you could have said, that - maybe - people found him to be too odd and overbearing, making Noah the only person in his vicinity, ready to accept his presence. It could have led to a sort of co-dependent relationship, until some magic researcher realized what he was and tried to capture him. In order to not endanger Noah, he finally leaves, as Noah is being picked up by said researchers and had his mind changed about who Reinhardt is. Reinhardt would have now had a reason to grow stronger than anyone, in order to protect what is important to him.
In your version, Reinhardt grows stronger and stronger as well - until he is, apparently, captured at last. Maybe I simply misunderstood you, but that part irks me as well, because it's far more complicated to capture a powerful being and keep it there, compared to just killing it. If he can't be killed, like Fushi from "To Your Eternity", then I haven't quite caught that from your text. You simply mention that they somehow cannot kill him, but he is, somehow, in their grasp for Noah to come up and offer to be his master.
But let's say the whole thing goes down, then Noah could then have pretended to still hold on to those old sentiments, in order to control him, with Reinhardt none-the-wiser. He may also start seeing that Reinhardt wasn't, in fact, an evil being, as he was told by the scientists, but simply trying to live and understand what he is and who he is. It would all come together once Noah comes clean and goes rogue, to fight the magic scientists alongside Reinhardt for a better future... or something. Actually, I made up whatever sounded somewhat fitting to your introduced setup. I tried finding a storyline that would make sense in the long run.
But basically, that's just one way. I meant to say that whatever you explained kind of doesn't check out. The post of @Ghundi_FreeMail is also important, but it's centered on everything afterwards. To reach the "afterwards", you first need to get to the starting line and everything on your way is just too thin to carry a plot like this; it would break under any point of pressure.

I advise you, from my humble point of view, to just deepen your thinking into the whole situation. And no, obviously I'm not a professional, but take it as the ramblings of an avid reader and a writer with over a decade of experience.

 

[Ghundi_FreeMail]

This is a lot to unpack.

Feeling weak won't happen since I edited that he can freely ask for permission to let his parameters off, one to three, so he isn't permanently capped (definitely should have added that first).

To keep tension, Noah is always skeptical of using Reinhardt as he does not have a great reputation, seen as a monster, unlike Noah, who is widely famous and loved by many, so it's like having a nuclear bomb on the ready and he doesn't want people to fear him.

It would also go against Reinhardt's character to feel resentment because he is incapable of feeling emotions other than curiosity because of his nature as a non-human, as such, he is always acting cheerful and joyful.

I did not know any of these details and they make a lot of things that I said obsolete.
I treated Reinhardt as a human convict who's under constant supervision, not a literal bored demigod, as I have to admit I haven't read the story, so I was answering from the point of taking your first edit of the post for granted. but yeah, I take back almost everything I said, this is outside of my field of experience, so I'll leave this forum to the professionals. Hope you find you answers soon.

 

[MakBow]

So I just walked out of the room and came back to realize that you had actually posted something right before I sent the text that I wrote. Basically everything is now for naught, but aside from that, that extra bit of information seems less kohesive of a story than before, somehow.

Like, let's go through this real quick, shall we?
He is a being that isn't human. But he does use a human body, so where did he come from? If he was "wandering", why is no one looking for him? This would have been something huge, even if the parents didn't know - they would have had some encounter with him, as he was wandering about, likely doing things that got on others nerves. He would have retaliated; showed his power.
He finds Noah, who seemingly acts like a doofus, fooling around with a child that isn't even human and wouldn't have known the first thing about pretending to be human (if he does later, he wouldn't have back then). But let's say he did, why is only Noah who's important to him and no one else in his "friend group"?
I always found these reasonings about how someone is important to a grand being, just because they aren't afraid of them or show interest that appears to be selfless, a very weak foundation to build up a relationship on that goes far enough to be considered an obsession. It's fine if there's a different reason for the two of them to be together and that first interest only sparks the relationship, but later on is build with entirely different things, just going back to that one selfless personality trait. But here, it just seems void of anything of that sort; it seeems like others could have filled that space just fine. He is interested in him and his "strength" from the beginning, so why would he become "strong", when the strength Noah has is clearly not physical, as Noah would have been a real child back then?
You say that only Noah "truly understands" him, but those are just words; they don't mean anything. What is it that Noah understands about him? And what is it that Reinhardt thinks he knows and understands about him?
Why is his "humanity" what Reinhardt thinks is the thing that surpasses him? And if that is truly his understanding of the situation, after becoming stronger and stronger, wouldn't he have wanted to stay close to Noah before that? He should have wanted to surround himself with humans; to emulate them.
Who knows? Then you could have said, that - maybe - people found him to be too odd and overbearing, making Noah the only person in his vicinity, ready to accept his presence. It could have led to a sort of co-dependent relationship, until some magic researcher realized what he was and tried to capture him. In order to not endanger Noah, he finally leaves, as Noah is being picked up by said researchers and had his mind changed about who Reinhardt is. Reinhardt would have now had a reason to grow stronger than anyone, in order to protect what is important to him.
In your version Reinhardt, grows stronger and stronger as well - until he is, apparently, captured at last. Maybe I simply misunderstood you, but that part irks me as well, because it's far more complicated to capture a powerful being and keep it there, compared to just killing it. If he can't be killed, like Fushi from "To Your Eternity", then I haven't quite caught that from your text. You simply mention that they somehow cannot kill him, but he is, somehow, in their grasp for Noah to come up and offer to be his master.
But let's say the whole thing goes down, then Noah could then have pretended to still hold on to those old sentiments, in order to control him, with Reinhardt none-the-wiser. He may also start seeing that Reinhardt wasn't, in fact, an evil being, as he was told by the scientists, but simply trying to live and understand what he is and who he is. It would all come together once Noah comes clean and goes rogue, to fight the magic scientists alongside Reinhardt for a better future... or something. Actually, I made up whatever sounded somewhat fitting to your introduced setup. I tried finding a storyline that would make sense in the long run.
But basically, that's just one way. I meant to say that whatever you explained kind of doesn't check out. The post of @Ghundi_FreeMail is also important, but it's centered on everything afterwards. To reach the "afterwards", you first need to get to the starting line and everything on your way is just too thin to carry a plot like this; it would break under any point of pressure.

I advise you, from my humble point of view, to just deepen you thinking into the whole situation. And no, obviously I'm not a professional, but take it as the ramblings of an avid reader and a writer with over a decade of experience.

Well, to answer the first part, he killed the kid's parents after taking his body and what he is, well, ana artifact of the cult of Adam, one of the main antagonists of the novel and yes, he has killed many, but only when threated or agitated, something Noah, as a child, did not do.

Yes, you are right, he doesn't know how to act human, more like a reserved animal back then, one that had some thought, but still like an animal, nonetheless.

To answer that if others filled the gap, they did yes, but Noah did it first. Everyone else is important, but I like to think for most living things, the first time is always the most important and why I incorporated it into his instinct.

The thing is, he doesn't only see strength purely as physical since magic also exist, but he isn't fully aware that Noah can't use magic and believes that Noah is hiding something.

I already made that clear: He BELIEVES that Noah understands his ideology of life and understands what makes Reinhardt 'weak' when that's simply not true. He's an overthinker.

Being surrounded by humans: Yes, he does do that and still does that. He's not in a cage or anything, he is allowed to wander and will be called upon when he needs to be.

Like I said: Reinhardt cannot feel anything other than curiosity which might as well be obsession. He cannot feel empathy, love.

To that being captured part, it's also fairly simply....he chose to be captured because he knew he would meet Noah again since he was searching for him after the split between their friend group.

(Lore Dump: The friend group decided to split up and go their separate ways before reuniting when they turn 18, but a lot happened and when it was time to reunite, Reinhardt was not familiar with direction, having wandered aimlessly, so when he learned that he would be meeting with Noah since the government didn't know what to do with him and because Noah is a very intelligence person well known for his skills in analyzing ways to dela with threats, he decided to let himself be captured to meet Noah, expecting the whole group.)

Noah wouldn't be picked on since people have far too much respect for him, I mean, he's literally the reason the world isn't in chaos with in experienced maguses.

Noah is well aware how evil he is and what he's done, but he is aware that Reinhardt cannot be killed so he takes advantage of their friendship, and Reinhardt cannot be deceived that easily, already aware Noah was doing that. He can easily tell if someone is lying and Noah knew that form the information he gathered.

In short, Noah knows Reinhardt cannot change and never will change, so it's best to keep him on a leash, and Reinhardt is aware of Noah's desire to keep him on a leash, using it as his chance to finally understand what he lacks, which doesn't exist, merely being his own overthinking for something grand and placing that limit upon himself.

That's the joke: he thinks there's more, he thinks there is a special ingredient, refusing to believe it is simple, when it is simple. He holds himself back and he cannot see that.

I often see that they make monsters have their gained humanity make them stronger. I don't want to do that. It's his lack of humanity that made him stronger, but he tries to gain humanity, which nerfs him, in turn, preventing him from truly being the strongest and so-called surpassing Noah.

Your insight is still useful regardless

 

[TheKillingAlice]

I did not know any of these details and they make a lot of things that I said obsolete.
I treated Reinhardt as a human convict who's under constant supervision, not a literal bored demigod, as I have to admit I haven't read the story, so I was answering from the point of taking your first edit of the post for granted. but yeah, I take back almost everything I said, this is outside of my field of experience, so I'll leave this forum to the professionals. Hope you find you answers soon.

If you don't mind taking it from a nobody like me: I don't think your post was that far off. I mean, when it comes to first posts, mine became obsolete as well, to a certain degree, but even that has still some merit left, just like yours. Because these are questions that will eventually be important, no matter what the other character may be.
A being so strong, even if they could use their full power at any given time, may some day grow bored or find something else that is interesting. The questions simply change, depending on the subject, therefore, your "aftermath" remains just as important in a story.

Well, to answer the first part, he killed the kid's parents after taking his body and what he is, well, ana artifact of the cult of Adam, one of the main antagonists of the novel and yes, he has killed many, but only when threated or agitated, something Noah, as a child, did not do.

So, in other words, as I said, he would have caused issues left and right. No way he goes around until he finds Noah, so he can introduce him to his "friend group".

To answer that if others filled the gap, they did yes, but Noah did it first. Everyone else is important, but I like to think for most living things, the first time is always the most important and why I incorporated it into his instinct.

Yes, which is why it is too weak. Being the "first" might mean "something", that much is surely true, but it doesn't mean enough in this case.
People also wouldn't have let anyone near him; not Noah, not anyone else. How long was he just "around", playing friends with him until they parted? It would have had to be long enough for them to leave an impression on him.
But he would have been a menace wherever he went. Even if he managed to get to a place where people who were undeniably on his tail didn't find him right away, as he doesn't know how to act human; he would have caused people to stir in the pot and those who already knew of him would come to get him.
Also, why would he have killed the parents of the body he possessed? If he doesn't feel emotions and is going to cause trouble either way, so people would have pursued him no matter what, it seems pointless.
And what exactly did Noah do, which wasn't something the parents of the boy he possessed would have tried? Were they immediately trying to kill him, as soon as they laid eyes upon him, not even bothering to safe their child? That goes against human nature; even the most passive parents care when their children die; parents care when their children die, even when they themself willingly caused it.
But I guess that's just a small issue, compared to the rest.
You say he isn't human, he doesn't have emotions, yet he clearly holds emotions for Noah and his friend group. If he's just curious and such an evil monster, he could have gotten any human to learn from them what it means to be human. But you say that it's because of what Reinhardt thinks that Noah "understands" about him and his way of life.

I already made that clear: He BELIEVES that Noah understands his ideology of life and understands what makes Reinhardt 'weak' when that's simply not true. He's an overthinker.

But that means nothing, as I said. What even is his "ideology of life"? If it's his missing humanity that makes him "weak", everyone who studies him would understand that much; in fact, it is something very human to say in the first place. In the end, how does his missing humanity make him "weak"? What was it, that made Noah as a child "strong"? In what way, that isn't emotional, did he "overpower" him? And why was he the first to overpower him in that way?
Also, to him, a child (as he doesn't seem to understand the concept of growing up, meaning he doesn't know that there's no way a child knows "powerful magic") would simply be a brainless creature. He would think he's an idiot, not knowing that's just him being a child - let alone think that he understands him in some way. And later on, once he's understood more of humanity, while simultaneously being a menacing being that everybody fears, wouldn't he understand that that is not the case, since he was just a child and stupid by default and then hadn't met him in many years? Why would he believe him to be special?
And how come a being that doesn't have emotions turns into an "overthinker"? Overthinking largely comes from anxiety, or the idea of filling in gaps when you try to align what you know with what you perceived to be an important thing to factor in, yet don't quite know. For example, if he factored in Noah's behavior, which should be this curious thing he doesn't understand. He wouldn't question human behavior, since he isn't human and doesn't understand being human. If he did, your claim of how he doesn't have any emotions and doesn't act on them would not hold water, because he would learn how to understand them and question things in light of these understandings, no matter if he himself naturally holds emotions or not. Emotionless creatures are like machines. They take what they see at face value; they won't interpret things they don't clearly understand, so overthinking seems far beyond his capability. [EDIT: Actually, think of someone with autism and how they can't read social cues. But while some autists, depending on where they are on the spectrum, may react with anxiety and stress, causing them to overthink, trying to decipher the cues they don't naturally perceive, that can't happen to Reinhardt, since he doesn't feel anxiety and can't get stressed out.]
His main point of personality, although it may be perceived that way, would also not be "curiosity", as even that is a human emotion. It would be him filling in for missing information. That, I understand. To take things in order to build up what isn't there; in order to set yourself up to a standard. But everything beyond that - be it curiosity; desire; obsession - they are all human emotions. The opposite of what you are trying to portray.

In short, Noah knows Reinhardt cannot change and never will change, so it's best to keep him on a leash, and Reinhardt is aware of Noah's desire to keep him on a leash, using it as his chance to finally understand what he lacks, which doesn't exist, merely being his own overthinking for something grand and placing that limit upon himself.

And to close this paragraph off: It means that he is, in fact, not on a leash. It means he can free himself at any given moment, otherwise, he wouldn't have let himself get caught. Since "real curiosity" is human, and you can't have one thing without the other. He could only understand that he needs to be powerful, but making sure oneself remains intact is of utmost importance, since a broken body is a body that cannot be strong. Letting someone have the hand over their power is illogical. Why would someone with no emotions and no humanity, who should be functioning solely on caculated risk and logic, do something so illogical, because he overthought something x amount of years ago and thus finds it a fun (which he shouldn't be able to, but whatever) experiment to have someone put a leash on him, because that person understands him, therefore he trusts him (which is also a human emotion and something he shouldn't believe in, as trust is a flimsy, emotional concept, no matter what it's based on). It would only make sense if it is not, in fact, trust, but the knowledge that he can free himself whenever he wants. That also means that Noah, if he's oh-so intelligent, should know it's all bullshit. If it's all make-believe, they don't need the whole capping thing going on; that would just be gold flitter on a turd. I don't understand his agency, just as I don't understand that of Reinhardt.
He would eventually realize that Noah understands nothing and move on; or find something more interesting and move on; or just realize that his time is being wasted and how inefficient his approach is and move on. Since he has no "personal" feelings and reasonings, there's nothing keeping him and doing something freely out of "curiosity" will always have its limitations in how long a reader will buy it.

Now, I understand it might come off as if I'm trying to bash your story - yes, I can tell - but what I'm actually trying to do is to give you the absolute state of what your insight into your story is telling me. Even if others may see it differently, because people are inherently different, you need to account for people trying to actually get behind your character.
And with that setup, you will have those who won't understand that he doesn't have emotions, because, frankly, for someone without humanity and emotions, he displays a metric ton of them. They would wonder why he does things, from an emotional point of view.
And those who catch that he's supposed to have no emotions will care about why he displays emotions whenever and however it fits the plot.
The only ones who likely won't question anything are those who read without thinking too deeply about it, and don't really try to understand the characters and their motivations in the first place.
But in the end, everything lies in the execution. Maybe reading it will cause less questions, since you condensed all of your own intentions with the character, which are usually not as clearly stated within a story. It may read quite differently in action. But that I can't pass judgement on, since I haven't read the actual story. I'm going off of the things you stated here and those alone.
That will likely be the last I add to this thread, so fret not. But in general, just take it as a point of view to challenge your writing, even if you can't understand why I keep banging on about this.

 

[MakBow]

If you don't mind taking it from a nobody like me: I don't think your post was that far off. I mean, when it comes to first posts, mine became obsolete as well, to a certain degree, but even that has still some merit left, just like yours. Because these are questions that will eventually be important, no matter what the other character may be.
A being so strong, even if they could use their full power at any given time, may some day grow bored or find something else that is interesting. The questions simply change, depending on the subject, therefore, your "aftermath" remains just as important in a story.



So, in other words, as I said, he would have caused issues left and right. No way he goes around until he finds Noah, so he can introduce him to his "friend group".

Yes, which is why it is too weak. Being the "first" might mean "something", that much is surely true, but it doesn't mean enough in this case.
People also wouldn't have let anyone near him; not Noah, not anyone else. How long was he just "around", playing friends with him until they parted? It would have had to be long enough for them to leave an impression on him.
But he would have been a menace wherever he went. Even if he managed to get to a place where people who were undeniably on his tail didn't find him right away, as he doesn't know how to act human; he would have caused people to stir in the pot and those who already knew of him would come to get him.
Also, why would he have killed the parents of the body he possessed? If he doesn't feel emotions and is going to cause trouble either way, so people would have pursued him no matter what, it seems pointless.
And what exactly did Noah do, which wasn't something the parents of the boy he possessed would have tried? Were they immediately trying to kill him, as soon as they laid eyes upon him, not even bothering to safe their child? That goes against human nature; even the most passive parents care when their children die; parents care when their children die, even when they themself willingly caused it.
But I guess that's just a small issue, compared to the rest.
You say he isn't human, he doesn't have emotions, yet he clearly holds emotions for Noah and his friend group. If he's just curious and such an evil monster, he could have gotten any human to learn from them what it means to be human. But you say that it's because of what Reinhardt thinks that Noah "understands" about him and his way of life.

But that means nothing, as I said. What even is his "ideology of life"? If it's his missing humanity that makes him "weak", everyone who studies him would understand that much; in fact, it is something very human to say in the first place. In the end, how does his missing humanity make him "weak"? What was it, that made Noah as a child "strong"? In what way, that isn't emotional, did he "overpower" him? And why was he the first to overpower him in that way?
Also, to him, a child (as he doesn't seem to understand the concept of growing up, meaning he doesn't know that there's no way a child knows "powerful magic") would simply be a brainless creature. He would think he's an idiot, not knowing that's just him being a child - let alone think that he understands him in some way. And later on, once he's understood more of humanity, while simultaneously being a menacing being that everybody fears, wouldn't he understand that that is not the case, since he was just a child and stupid by default and then hadn't met him in many years? Why would he believe him to be special?
And how come a being that doesn't have emotions turns into an "overthinker"? Overthinking largely comes from anxiety, or the idea of filling in gaps when you try to align what you know with what you perceived to be an important thing to factor in, yet don't quite know. For example, if he factored in Noah's behavior, which should be this curious thing he doesn't understand. He wouldn't question human behavior, since he isn't human and doesn't understand being human. If he did, your claim of how he doesn't have any emotions and doesn't act on them would not hold water, because he would learn how to understand them and question things in light of these understandings, no matter if he himself naturally holds emotions or not. Emotionless creatures are like machines. They take what they see at face value; they won't interpret things they don't clearly understand, so overthinking seems far beyond his capability. [EDIT: Actually, think of someone with autism and how they can't read social cues. But while some autists, depending on where they are on the spectrum, may react with anxiety and stress, causing them to overthink, trying to decipher the cues they don't naturally perceive, that can't happen to Reinhardt, since he doesn't feel anxiety and can't get stressed out.]
His main point of personality, although it may be perceived that way, would also not be "curiosity", as even that is a human emotion. It would be him filling in for missing information. That, I understand. To take things in order to build up what isn't there; in order to set yourself up to a standard. But everything beyond that - be it curiosity; desire; obsession - they are all human emotions. The opposite of what you are trying to portray.


And to close this paragraph off: It means that he is, in fact, not on a leash. It means he can free himself at any given moment, otherwise, he wouldn't have let himself get caught. Since "real curiosity" is human, and you can't have one thing without the other. He could only understand that he needs to be powerful, but making sure oneself remains intact is of utmost importance, since a broken body is a body that cannot be strong. Letting someone have the hand over their power is illogical. Why would someone with no emotions and no humanity, who should be functioning solely on caculated risk and logic, do something so illogical, because he overthought something x amount of years ago and thus finds it a fun (which he shouldn't be able to, but whatever) experiment to have someone put a leash on him, because that person understands him, therefore he trusts him (which is also a human emotion and something he shouldn't believe in, as trust is a flimsy, emotional concept, no matter what it's based on). It would only make sense if it is not, in fact, trust, but the knowledge that he can free himself whenever he wants. That also means that Noah, if he's oh-so intelligent, should know it's all bullshit. If it's all make-believe, they don't need the whole capping thing going on; that would just be gold flitter on a turd. I don't understand his agency, just as I don't understand that of Reinhardt.
He would eventually realize that Noah understands nothing and move on; or find something more interesting and move on; or just realize that his time is being wasted and how inefficient his approach is and move on. Since he has no "personal" feelings and reasonings, there's nothing keeping him and doing something freely out of "curiosity" will always have its limitations in how long a reader will buy it.

Now, I understand it might come off as if I'm trying to bash your story - yes, I can tell - but what I'm actually trying to do is to give you the absolute state of what your insight into your story is telling me. Even if others may see it differently, because people are inherently different, you need to account for people trying to actually get behind your character.
And with that setup, you will have those who won't understand that he doesn't have emotions, because, frankly, for someone without humanity and emotions, he displays a metric ton of them. They would wonder why he does things, from an emotional point of view.
And those who catch that he's supposed to have no emotions will care about why he displays emotions whenever and however it fits the plot.
The only ones who likely won't question anything are those who read without thinking too deeply about it, and don't really try to understand the characters and their motivations in the first place.
But in the end, everything lies in the execution. Maybe reading it will cause less questions, since you condensed all of your own intentions with the character, which are usually not as clearly stated within a story. It may read quite differently in action. But that I can't pass judgement on, since I haven't read the actual story. I'm going off of the things you stated here and those alone.
That will likely be the last I add to this thread, so fret not. But in general, just take it as a point of view to challenge your writing, even if you can't understand why I keep banging on about this.

I can understand a lot of the things you say, but some of these things I already addressed in the lineup, but they're hyper specific.

I won't mention everything, but just a few:

He never searched for Noah's friend group when they were kids, he wandered until he stumbled upon them. Don't know if my wording was bad.

Noah had abusive and neglectful parents at the time, so he spent more time away from home.

The only people who saw his face were dead. He was more so a legend that people believed was a mythical beast, so he can still wander because no one knows what he looks like. And he killed the parents because they knew (I'm not getting into the hyper specific situation)

For a little lore: demon lords, which is what Reinhardt is, are a forbidden race, so most know to kill them on the spot, but Noah wasn't taught that yet nor was his childhood friends (Might I add they are very involved in the story I'm setting up)

I guess no emotion was a big of a hyperbole, I apologize, it's more so EXTREMELY little emotion.

For the why Noah is special part......it's a lot of mystery and lore involved with Noah and outer god stuff.

Yeah, I'll fix that part on the overthinking, since I don't want him to be a machine. No anxiety, just a desire to fill in the gaps.

He can't free himself, never said that. He can request permission to have his parameters unlocked, which is his powers, but Noah doesn't have to give him permission. At his current level and by way of the parameters work, Noah is the only thing that can harm him.

Thank you for this paragraph that I had to drown my eyes in. I will take some of the things here and apply them to the character.

 

[TheKillingAlice]

He never searched for Noah's friend group when they were kids, he wandered until he stumbled upon them. Don't know if my wording was bad.

Damn, I came back after all. This is a horrible habit of mine, I'm sorry.
So, basically, I caught that. I think my own words might have been too unspecific. Around that part where I make the point of how much they wouldn't let him get near anyone, I meant to say that him wandering around until he found Noah made no sense. Especially, since he would have had to have the chance to engage with them long and undisturbed enough to make that meaningful connection.
You say they are all dead, but he also doesn't kill without reason, apparently, otherwise... Noah and his friends should be dead. So everyone, including Noah and his friends, would know. If someone saw a really odd child and later, everyone is dead, they would most definitely tell someone about it and someone would make the connection, as soon as it happened twice. They might even ask people if they had seen this child around the perimeter of one of his slaughterings.
If magic is such a big thing in this world, why is there nothing that can confirm the nature of this menace they all fear? It would be something I strongly question as a reader, because "There's no one to notice - if there's no one left to notice" is a Meme, not a viable story element, for the most part. At least, mention things that would counter my arguments, so you cover your bases.

For a little lore: demon lords, which is what Reinhardt is, are a forbidden race, so most know to kill them on the spot, but Noah wasn't taught that yet nor was his childhood friends (Might I add they are very involved in the story I'm setting up)

I thought he was an artifact, which took over a human child, but now he's a demon lord? What would be the natural progression for that?
And especially children would be told that demon lords are bad. Like, this isn't something to be "taught", but rather "instilled". If you want to make sure that children know this, you will tell them that "the demon lord will come to visit, when you don't listen to your mother". It's supposed to make them afraid, so they understand, early on, that this is the enemy, without every questioning it. It's a form of indoctrination.
If the qualifier is "kill them on the spot", that much should be a given.

He can't free himself, never said that. He can request permission to have his parameters unlocked, which is his powers, but Noah doesn't have to give him permission. At his current level and by way of the parameters work, Noah is the only thing that can harm him.

Ah, sorry, I meant that as a thought experiment. I went through the options, after clarifying what this character is meant to be.
No matter if it's "no emotion", as you earlier explained it, "or extremely little emotion", as you cleared up now, it wouldn't be enough to make him stay with Noah, even if the thinks that it will help him. Not only because of how he should understand that Noah knows nothing special about him, but also because it makes no sense for a being seeking power to get leashed. It outweighs the cost and put the "body" at risk, which is the base of any power to begin with.
That's what my rambling through these options meant: To see this decision for what it is. It's illogical, no matter how much he overthinks and believes that Noah has all the answers. He would have to give him something - something that would make Reinhardt sure he truly knows.
There's a story in my head, which I can't remember the name of - it's a Webtoon, in which a mother, who's technically a queen, goes back in time, because her way of raising her son made him turn out to be a broken adult who kills everyone and then himself. She now wants to raise him properly in this life (actually, I think that sentence right there might be the actual title, lol), catching up to all of her failings, and that involves that she used to be some sort of great magician. There's this dude whose magic tower she used to be a part of and she holds the knowledge of how even he, who tried for so long to no avail, would be able to reach the "next stage" in his abilities. She says, if he agrees to officially support her son, in order to strengthen his position and put a safety net out for him, she will hand over that knowledge to him. It's been a while, but she already gives him a bit of said knowlegde, so he would bite.
Or an even earlier example from "According to Jim", that just came to mind, where Jim's wife Cheryl wants to get someone she knows through her daughter (it's just some other Mom) to do something for her, in exchange she would get a recipe for some cake or whatever, which she always wins a school bake-off with. She rips the recipe in two and hands her one half as bait.
I know, it doesn't have to be exactly this way, but I use these examples because they ring true and make the audience question the situation less. Since the other party was able to confirm they can even get whatever perk they are aiming for, it makes sense for them to go to whatever lengths needed in order to obtain what they are missing.
If he's so strong and knows that Noah is lying and only seeks for strength, with no emotional bond to anyone, there's literally no reason for him to even be captured. He could just wait nearby and capture Noah; torture and force him to speak up about what he desires to know or take him apart in order to find out by himself. There's no reason for him to put his own existence at risk, by playing slave to someone who may or may not know some grand secret, based on something he perceived x amount of years ago, when the other party was still a mere child.

For the why Noah is special part......it's a lot of mystery and lore involved with Noah and outer god stuff.

That also seems like something that should be brought up sooner. Especially since it jumbles up the things already stated quite a bit. Is he or is he not someone who held special powers that outweighed those of Reinhardt even when he was still a child? And it still begs the question: How was he ever stronger than Reinhardt, without an emotional factor? Because if it was an emotional factor, just like many other aspects, it would mean he holds quite a bit of human emotion inside of him.

Well, I guess, those are just some more things to ponder. Have fun.

 

[MakBow]

Damn, I came back after all. This is a horrible habit of mine, I'm sorry.
So, basically, I caught that. I think my own words might have been too unspecific. Around that part where I make the point of how much they wouldn't let him get near anyone, I meant to say that him wandering around until he found Noah made no sense. Especially, since he would have had to have the chance to engage with them long and undisturbed enough to make that meaningful connection.
You say they are all dead, but he also doesn't kill without reason, apparently, otherwise... Noah and his friends should be dead. So everyone, including Noah and his friends, would know. If someone saw a really odd child and later, everyone is dead, they would most definitely tell someone about it and someone would make the connection, as soon as it happened twice. They might even ask people if they had seen this child around the perimeter of one of his slaughterings.
If magic is such a big thing in this world, why is there nothing that can confirm the nature of this menace they all fear? It would be something I strongly question as a reader, because "There's no one to notice - if there's no one left to notice" is a Meme, not a viable story element, for the most part. At least, mention things that would counter my arguments, so you cover your bases.

I thought he was an artifact, which took over a human child, but now he's a demon lord? What would be the natural progression for that?
And especially children would be told that demon lords are bad. Like, this isn't something to be "taught", but rather "instilled". If you want to make sure that children know this, you will tell them that "the demon lord will come to visit, when you don't listen to your mother". It's supposed to make them afraid, so they understand, early on, that this is the enemy, without every questioning it. It's a form of indoctrination.
If the qualifier is "kill them on the spot", that much should be a given.

Ah, sorry, I meant that as a thought experiment. I went through the options, after clarifying what this character is meant to be.
No matter if it's "no emotion", as you earlier explained it, "or extremely little emotion", as you cleared up now, it wouldn't be enough to make him stay with Noah, even if the thinks that it will help him. Not only because of how he should understand that Noah knows nothing special about him, but also because it makes no sense for a being seeking power to get leashed. It outweighs the cost and put the "body" at risk, which is the base of any power to begin with.
That's what my rambling through these options meant: To see this decision for what it is. It's illogical, no matter how much he overthinks and believes that Noah has all the answers. He would have to give him something - something that would make Reinhardt sure he truly knows.
There's a story in my head, which I can't remember the name of - it's a Webtoon, in which a mother, who's technically a queen, goes back in time, because her way of raising her son made him turn out to be a broken adult who kills everyone and then himself. She now wants to raise him properly in this life (actually, I think that sentence right there might be the actual title, lol), catching up to all of her failings, and that involves that she used to be some sort of great magician. There's this dude whose magic tower she used to be a part of and she holds the knowledge of how even he, who tried for so long to no avail, would be able to reach the "next stage" in his abilities. She says, if he agrees to officially support her son, in order to strengthen his position and put a safety net out for him, she will hand over that knowledge to him. It's been a while, but she already gives him a bit of said knowlegde, so he would bite.
Or an even earlier example from "According to Jim", that just came to mind, where Jim's wife Cheryl wants to get someone she knows through her daughter (it's just some other Mom) to do something for her, in exchange she would get a recipe for some cake or whatever, which she always wins a school bake-off with. She rips the recipe in two and hands her one half as bait.
I know, it doesn't have to be exactly this way, but I use these examples because they ring true and make the audience question the situation less. Since the other party was able to confirm they can even get whatever perk they are aiming for, it makes sense for them to go to whatever lengths needed in order to obtain what they are missing.
If he's so strong and knows that Noah is lying and only seeks for strength, with no emotional bond to anyone, there's literally no reason for him to even be captured. He could just wait nearby and capture Noah; torture and force him to speak up about what he desires to know or take him apart in order to find out by himself. There's no reason for him to put his own existence at risk, by playing slave to someone who may or may not know some grand secret, based on something he perceived x amount of years ago, when the other party was still a mere child.

That also seems like something that should be brought up sooner. Especially since it jumbles up the things already stated quite a bit. Is he or is he not someone who held special powers that outweighed those of Reinhardt even when he was still a child? And it still begs the question: How was he ever stronger than Reinhardt, without an emotional factor? Because if it was an emotional factor, just like many other aspects, it would mean he holds quite a bit of human emotion inside of him.

Well, I guess, those are just some more things to ponder. Have fun.

Just to add, demon lords are artifact being created by the artifacts of the cult of Adam. He is an artifact, one that evolved into what the artifact is supposed to be...a demon lord.

But yeah, just forget all of this other stuff I mentioned because it's getting overwritten.

I'll tell you the new character after I write it and you can give your thoughts