Tragedy slop and Isekai slop are created equal

Envylope

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Well-written Tragedy is good. Well-written Isekai is good.

In a well-constructed story, everything has a purpose. In a good isekai, the characters have a reason to exist. Each of them are battling with something in their lives, and they have goals. They try to make something of themselves, or they have a reason for acting as a foil against the protagonist. You don't include characters to fit a trope. The characters exist in spite of whatever trope they fill.

Tragedy is the exact same. Everything needs a purpose. People need reasons that they die. The dark themes that get explored shouldn't exist just because you wanted a dark story.

This is Tragedy slop. I see too often that people delude themselves into thinking their story is somehow more intelligent than isekai slop. "Look at me! My main character is not overpowered, and people have the threat of death looming around the corner!"

Good for you. Killing off characters is not that deep. You shouldn't be thinking of unique ways that you can kill them off, you should be thinking of how their death helps your narrative. There is no emotional impact in people dying needlessly.

When you think about it, it's even easier to make Tragedy slop. The person making it deludes his/her self into thinking that they're a superior author. All they are doing is making a story that takes no skill at all. "Look at me, I can have some vague sad undertones and start killing people. Wow, even the MC has a chance of dying!"
 

AliceMoonvale

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Exhibit A

George RR Martin
Game of Thrones

Don't be like him. He is neither cool nor mature. Though he is laughing at us all, all the way to the bank.

#Nedstarkwasthemc

I rest my case.
Oh no, game of thrones. Lmao. I try not to think about television war crimes. :blob_hmph:
I still remember the disaster that was The Walking Dead.
Make a thousand more spinoffs all you want, it will never erase the giant shit stain of a show on your white mattress
 

CharlesEBrown

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Oh no, game of thrones. Lmao. I try not to think about television war crimes. :blob_hmph:
I still remember the disaster that was The Walking Dead.
Make a thousand more spinoffs all you want, it will never erase the giant shit stain of a show on your white mattress
So you're saying AMC Amber Heard-ed the franchise? From what I managed to see of S2 (liked S1 until they got to the CDC. Never really "felt" it much and got bored in S2), that's about right.

I mean. there's a fine line between boring tedium and tense suspense, and to borrow a line from Sam and Max Hit The Road, the show skipped rope with it...
 

JayMark

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When you think about it, it's even easier to make Tragedy slop. The person making it deludes his/her self into thinking that they're a superior author. All they are doing is making a story that takes no skill at all. "Look at me, I can have some vague sad undertones and start killing people. Wow, even the MC has a chance of dying!"
Why am I feeling called out?
Probably because of a comment I made earlier about my experimental passion project.
Yes, where I explicitely said the MC could die and the narrative still continue.
Oh well, I feel like I do what I do well enough for the most part and meet the requirements for something to not be slop.
I kill off characters when the world and narrative calls for it.
And i will explore death, loss, suffering, etc because I am multi-faceted and prefer to explore many things.
Same for making characters suffer, experience hope, or joy.
Oh no, is it both isekai and tragedyslop at the same time?
I really don't think so. Personally, I feel like if I wrote slop, I'd be more successful.
For all my flaws, I don't consider myself a slop or hack writer.
Just an unpopular one.
So I will soldier on.
 

Envylope

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Why am I feeling called out?
Probably because of a comment I made earlier about my experimental passion project.
Yes, where I explicitely said the MC could die and the narrative still continue.
Oh well, I feel like I do what I do well enough for the most part and meet the requirements for something to not be slop.
I kill off characters when the world and narrative calls for it.
And i will explore death, loss, suffering, etc because I am multi-faceted and prefer to explore many things.
Same for making characters suffer, experience hope, or joy.
Oh no, is it both isekai and tragedyslop at the same time?
I really don't think so. Personally, I feel like if I wrote slop, I'd be more successful.
For all my flaws, I don't consider myself a slop or hack writer.
Just an unpopular one.
So I will soldier on.
I was not thinking of anyone particular when I made this. If one feels called out, that's on them. This was more of me just thinking about this.
 

PancakesWitch

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A Regressor's Tale of Cultivation is both Tragedy and Isekai but written really well, all the tragedy has meaning because it allows the main character to continously evolve through every timeline he experiences and every connection, even of those he lost, remain within him and they even become his unique cultivation method, the best part is that even after hundreds of thousands of years he's still a human being. He cries, suffers, and cries to the heavens and never becomes emotionless or cold despite how much suffering he has faced. After crying and suffering, he cleans his tears and continues moving forward because he knows that he cannot give up, because he will always be forced to the starting point no matter how much he wants to die. I recommend all of you to read it if you haven't, probably the best Cultivation Story Korea has ever produced.
Also the story is written in a way that even those that know nothing about Cultivation can read it and enjoy it and understand how it all works, it's actually an excellent starting point, similar to Gu Daoist/Reverend Insanity
 

Anonjohn20

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Well-written Tragedy is good. Well-written Isekai is good.
You know what isn't stated? "Well-written fan fiction is good." The wise queen knows it would be a lie. LOL JK

So you're saying AMC Amber Heard-ed the franchise? From what I managed to see of S2 (liked S1 until they got to the CDC. Never really "felt" it much and got bored in S2), that's about right.

I mean. there's a fine line between boring tedium and tense suspense, and to borrow a line from Sam and Max Hit The Road, the show skipped rope with it...
Season 1 of TWD was very accurate to the comic and well liked; season 2 was filmed entirely on a farm with no budget because AMC blew their entire budget on a different show called "Mad Men" (mostly buying retro clothes, renting classic cars, and buying expensive whiskey for the actors to drink); season 3 and the first half of season 4 made TWD the most popular show to ever exist on TV; then they switched showrunners on the second half of season 4, and from that second half up until season 8, we got a slow, jumbled mess with awful pacing issues. Seasons 9 to 11 were fixed (due to them switching showrunners again), but by then no one was watching the show anymore.
 

AliceMoonvale

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You know what isn't stated? "Well-written fan fiction is good." The wise queen knows it would be a lie. LOL JK


Season 1 of TWD was very accurate to the comic and well liked; season 2 was filmed entirely on a farm with no budget because AMC blew their entire budget on a different show called "Mad Men" (mostly buying retro clothes, renting classic cars, and buying expensive whiskey for the actors to drink); season 3 and the first half of season 4 made TWD the most popular show to ever exist on TV; then they switched showrunners on the second half of season 4, and from that second half up until season 8, we got a slow, jumbled mess with awful pacing issues. Seasons 9 to 11 were fixed (due to them switching showrunners again), but by then no one was watching the show anymore.
They ruined it when the showrunners were switched and they began killing off characters that aren't even dead in the comics, plus keeping characters alive that were supposed to be dead. It was terrible. lol
 

Anonjohn20

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and they began killing off characters that aren't even dead in the comics, plus keeping characters alive that were supposed to be dead.
The show deviating from the comics was done completely with the approval of Robert Kirkman (the guy who made the comics for TWD and Invincible); he was still very much involved in the direction the show took. The problem was the pacing. They'd end an episode on one character's cliffhanger and then switch to a different character, and then do so again and again, and if you wanted to find out what happened after the cliffhanger, you needed to wait 3-5 episodes. When only one episode was shown a week, knowing you had to wait a month to see the resolution of that cliffhanger would just kill the pacing; it was hard to be excited for the next episode when they'd take a detour/interlude from the narrative the previous episode had.

I know that the show is slightly more bearable now that you can binge all the episodes at once, but I just lost interest completely by the time season 4 finished. A funny thing was watching the talented cast tour Comic-Cons and other conventions, basically begging nerds not to give up on the show. I got to see Merle, and my older brother in a different state got to see Michonne.
 

JayMark

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The show deviating from the comics was done completely with the approval of Robert Kirkman (the guy who made the comics for TWD and Invincible); he was still very much involved in the direction the show took. The problem was the pacing. They'd end an episode on one character's cliffhanger and then switch to a different character, and then do so again and again, and if you wanted to find out what happened after the cliffhanger, you needed to wait 3-5 episodes. When only one episode was shown a week, knowing you had to wait a month to see the resolution of that cliffhanger would just kill the pacing; it was hard to be excited for the next episode when they'd take a detour/interlude from the narrative the previous episode had.

I know that the show is slightly more bearable now that you can binge all the episodes at once, but I just lost interest completely by the time season 4 finished. A funny thing was watching the talented cast tour Comic-Cons and other conventions, basically begging nerds not to give up on the show. I got to see Merle, and my older brother in a different state got to see Michonne.
They did rely way too heavily on cliffhanger. Also zombie behavior got inconsistently weird in a way that wasn't foreshadowed properly. It got boring afer they reached Alexendria.
 

BigBadBoi

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It's only worse when people kill off their characters just because they don't care/are tired of them. lmao
b-but muh le grimdark tragedy...
They ruined it when the showrunners were switched and they began killing off characters that aren't even dead in the comics, plus keeping characters alive that were supposed to be dead. It was terrible. lol
btw the real reason why they killed Carl off in the show is because the actor was turning 18. They really killed him off just to avoid paying more. The poor dude even both a house and applied to a college near the set.
 

Zinless

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I've been saying this stuff for a year and a half now.

Don't write out of spite.

If you found a slop you hate, doing the opposite of that doesn't mean success. Sometimes, it could end up even worse than the one you're trying to "one up".

Remember kids, just because your story doesn't have an OP MC or harems or power fantasies... doesn't mean it's better than ones that do.

Failing to see that, along with writing out of spite, are the source of the perceived superiority Crimsy was talking about.
 
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